[Buddha-l] Re: Piti and the Jhannas

[jkirk]

I don't have too many materials on *piti* or joy, except a downloaded
version of Narada Maha Thera's
*Abidhamma*
(http://www.budsas.org/ebud/abhisgho/abhis01.htm). 
The text speaks of *piti* as "jhana-resultant consciousness."  
 
I hope that clarifying the concept of *piti* will help answer my question on
the role (if any) that joy and happiness play in Buddhism.  

Katherine Masis
=====================
Right, Katherine,
Since there are texts (a text?) on piti, the issue arises. My probably
flawed sense of where joy comes in Buddhism is that searching for it among
the teachings is a huge endeavor, because it appears in many different
locations. Few years ago I tried to work on whether Buddhism has a visual
(as opposed to a literary) esthetic, and found several passages in the Pali
verses. These were written by ascetics finding joy in the beauties of the
forest as a place conducive to practice. (I will try to find them in my
folders but can't get to them at this minute.) At that time this list also
considered how Japanese Buddhism seemed to have expanded the notion of
mudita beyond joy in one's or another's blessings to joy in the beauties of
nature as it appears to the contemplative. 

Gary Gach posted some illuminating comments in the Japanese Buddhism sector.


Since this thread had to do with happiness or joy arising from perceptions
of beauty, it was probably restricted as compared to your queries this week.

Ven. Dhammanando contributed a lot to the discussion as to what is
permissable for monks vis a vis joy or pleasure from beauty encountered as
_entertainment_ (what is called jatra today in India--popular theater, which
grew out of classic theater of ancient times). The point was, they should
not intentionally go to see "shows", but if they accidentally encountered
one and stopped for a while to check it out, it wasn't a big offense. (I may
have garbled his comment a bit here--but I think tthis is close to the
point.) The discussion led on to the classical rasas in Indian literature
and Abhinavagupta. 

Here is what Gary sent, but this page is unavailable now (this thread
happened 3 years ago!. I tried getting a chached page on google to no avail.
It used to be:
--Haiku: A New Word, A New World - http://awakening.to/haiku.html .)
Thoughts on haiku by Gary Gach, with links to poems and comments from
workshops he's led in the San Francisco Bay Area.)-- Maybe Gary would send
us a new link.
Anyway this is what he sent 3 years ago and I found it a provocative
comparison to joy from beauty as found in the Theravada tradition:

"I've compiled a short list of some major Japanese "rasas," based on haiku
appreciation (additional ones can be found in gardening, incense ceremony,
etc): http://awakening.to/haiku.html#aware

While HHDL maybe never defines "happiness," we also use the English terms
happiness and joy in a variety of contexts and with a variety of meanings. 

Joy and happiness in Buddhist literature seem to me to be more restricted
than they are outside the Buddhist context, but Vietnamese, Chinese and
Japanese Buddhists seem to have expanded the concept of joy to include a
wider range of referents than found in, say, the Theravada tradition.

Far as I can tell, the Pali texts speak of happiness while experiencing
certain jhanas, but warn the practicer not to cling to it, but you already
know this.

Cheers, Joanna







       
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