[Buddha-l] Non attached & mindful culinary triumphalism?

[Kdorje at aol.com]

There is a distinction in law that seems to be the same. Crime malum in se  
are those that are based on English common law and are said to the natural, 
 moral or public principles of a civilized society, sometimes said to be 
the  result of a depraved heart. Examples are murder, theft, rape, and most  
crimes of violence. On the other hand are crimes malum prohibitum, those acts 
 that are prohibited by statutes enacted for the efficient running of 
society,  such as parking restrictions, speed limits, tax evasion.
 
Best wishes,
 
Konchog Dorje
 
 
In a message dated 7/13/2011 10:12:35 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
vasubandhu at earthlink.net writes:

>All  these passages seem to be talking about what is blameworthy and 
frowned  
>upon (sāvadya), which I take to be a rather different concept from  
>prohibited (pratiṣedha).

That's part of how Buddhists used the  term, but not the whole picture. Cf. 
Edgerton's Buddhist-Hybrid  Dictionary, p. 594; PTS Pali-Eng Dict, p. 707. 
It 
is not just how others  look at something (assigning blame), but also a 
flaw 
in someone's  character or criminality in action.

The Chinese translators used two  equivalents to render sāvadya in this 
context:

1. jie 戒, which  means precept, rule, discipline, śīla, etc.

2. zui 罪, wrongdoing,  crime, misdeed, "sin," etc.

One finds, for instance, discussions of the  "two types of crimes" 二罪 (er 
zui):

(a) 性罪 (xing zui)  prakṛti-sāvadya, "a crime by its very nature", 
understood as a crime which  is wrong in itself, such as murder, etc.;
(b) 遮罪 (zhe zui)  pratikṣepaṇa-sāvadya, "a crime against what has been 
prohibited or  forbidden", i.e., the monastic rules. Its conventional 
nature 
is also  captured when the term prajñapti-sāvadya is used, prajñapti 
implying 
here  something conventionally-derived.

These terms are also rendered in  Chinese as:
(a) 性戒 (xing jie) prakṛti-śīla, prakṛti-sāvadya, i.e., rules in  
accordance 
with the nature (of actions). (NB: This term can also be used  when talking 
about positive deeds, esp. the 10 basic kusala  activities.)

(b) 遮戒 (zhe jie) pratikṣepaṇa-sāvadya, prohibitive  precepts.

To be clear:
性 xing = "nature" (as in Buddha-nature,  human-nature, and is used by some 
translators like Xuanzang for -tā and  -tva suffixes). It is the 'nature of 
x".

遮 zhe means to forbid,  reject, prohibit, bar, hinder, etc., and one of its 
attested equivalents  is pratiṣedha.

To illustrate the meaning of the Chinese term zui 罪  (wrongdoing, crime) in 
non-Buddhist contexts, here are the senses and some  common expressions 
using 
the term from Lin Yutang's Chinese-English  Dictionary:
http://humanum.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/Lexis/Lindict/

(1)   A criminal act: 犯罪 commit crime;
有罪 guilty;
無罪 innocent;
死罪 a capital  crime;
罪上加罪 doubly guilty;
罪有應得 serve you right;
罪該萬死 hideous crime  deserving the harshest punishment;
罪犯 [zui4fan4], 罪人 [zui4ren2];
罪名  [zui4ming2], 罪狀 [zui4zhuang4];
罪魁 [zui4kui2].

(2)  Wrongdoing,  misconduct, a sin, moral transgression: 罪過 [zui4guo4], 罪孽
  
[zui4nie4]↓;
罪過兒 a wicked act, (retribution for) wrongdoing;
罪惡  [zui4e4]
罪戾 [zui4li4]1 ;
罪愆 [zui4qian1] ;
得罪 give offense to  (s.o.);
問罪 denounce and punish: 興問罪之師 make a punitive expedition;
告罪  (LL) publicly announce criminal charges against person: (modn.) 
“excuse  me, please,”“pardon me,”“I am sorry”;
請罪 ask person for pardon, acknowledge  one's guilt (fault, mistake).

(3)  Hardships, sufferings, painful  experience: 受罪 suffer mental agony 
(physical pain).
Words 1. 罪案  [zui4an4], n., (law) a criminal case.
2. 罪愆 [zui4qian1], n., a guilty  conscience, wicked acts.
3. 罪惡 [zui4e4], n., a deadly crime.
4. 罪犯  [zui4fan4], n., a criminal, a condemned prisoner.
5. 罪過 [zui4guo4], n., a  guilty conscience: “罪過，罪過”(court.)“you 
give me a guilty conscience” (by  extending courtesies).
6. 罪己 [zui4ji3], v.i., to blame oneself for  wrongdoing: 下罪己詔(of a 
ruler) acknowledge by royal decree one's  responsibility for misgovernment 
or 
national calamity.
7. 罪狀  [zui4zhuang4], n., an indictment against person for crime committed.
8. 罪魁  [zui4kui2], n., chief culprit.
9. 罪戾 [zui4li4]1, n., criminal  responsibility.
10. 罪隸 [zui4li4]2, n., dependents of criminals forced into  slavery.
11. 罪名 [zui4ming2]([zui4ming0]), n., criminal charges leveled  against a 
person.
12. 罪孽 [zui4nie4]([zui4nie0]), n., (1) wrongdoing,  sin; a (2) retribution 
for wrong done.
13. 罪人 [zui4ren2], (1) n., a  convict; (2) v.i., to blame s.o. for 
misconduct.
14. 罪行 [zui4xing4],  n., a criminal act.
15. 罪責 [zui4ze2], n., responsibility for  misconduct.

This is more than community disapproval, though that is  also entailed. 
Blame 
is not assigned arbitrarily or merely conventionally,  but according to the 
nature of the action.

Dan  

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