[Buddha-l] Batchelor

[JKirkpatrick]

Perhaps it would help if you expanded your array of Buddhist
thinkers as a way to move out of the either/or dilemma.  For a
start, you might find the views of Ven. Buddhadasa helpful: 
see _Heartwood of the Bodhi Tree_, Wisdom Pubs, 1994. He arrived
at what I consider to be progressive (not rooted in the
past/tradition as he received it) views on rebirth & karma.
I'm surprised that Buddhadasa was not even mentioned in
Batchelor's latest book, as his views would seem to be right down
Batchelor's alley.

Having recently read Epicurus, I don't recall Epicurus working
with a dukkha concept similar to what's found in Buddhism-- he
was more relaxed than that. I don't recall him "looking forward
to death" as you say,  but may be misremembering. As I recall,
his emphasis was ever on the wise man being content with
necessities but otherwise with little. Again as I recall,
Epicurus thought that being preoccupied with and afraid of death
was pointless.   (Sort of like the Buddha considering that being
preoccupied with the concern of 'was there a creator deity or
not' was pointless.) Epicurus wrote against grasping and craving,
yes, but wasn't focused on such concepts as bodhi or nirvana
which it seems had not even occurred to him.  

Best, Joanna

________________________________________________



On Behalf Of lemmett at talk21.com

Hello.
Is there a middle ground between rebirth and thinking that karma
is purely psychological? I can't think of one. Sorry if I've
misrepresented Batchelor here. Slight tangent but would you say
that Epicurus' advice (that death is not to be feared because
we're not there) is according to Buddhism also a source of stress
and so even on its own terms is impractical. In what other ways
might Epicurus be wrong? E.g., I'd imagine that for him looking
forward to death is equally illogical but looking forward to
nirvana is not, right? Why and can you help me make sense of
that?
I don't want to gloss 'nirvana' and 'death', which brings me back
to Batchelor: is karma at best a cure for nihilism?
Thanks for any help.