[Buddha-l] Batchelor

[Zelders.YH]

Joy wrote :

>Buddhist existentialism sounds like a contradiction in terms.

You think so ?

>Existence is characterised by the suffering of
>birth, old age, illness and death. If there is only existence, where
>exactly is one to find the door to the immortal or simply to the end
>of suffering caused by the conditioned, which existence is? Or is
>there one existence but different levels of existence or somesuch,
>which could be a play on words? How many of the Four Noble Truths are
>left over? These are some of the questions that spring in my mind
>without having read the book.

There's all kind of buddhisms as you yourself brought forward a few 
days ago. Batchelor's buddhism is not for everybody, that's for sure. 
I'm sure it is not his ambition to become the buddhist prophet of the 
21st century. The book contains his personal conclusions after forty 
years of deep commitment to buddhist teachings and to meditation 
practice, and it gives the impression that it arose out of some 
strongly felt inner necessity. The man is quite knowledgeable and 
experienced. What more would one wish for an interesting read 
?  Then, reading the book, one can agree or disagree with this or 
that but surely a lot of one's (pre-)suppositions will be challenged, 
and isn't that always a good thing ?

Speaking for myself, there is one thing in the book that greatly 
puzzles me : in my view the notion of karma - in the sense of 
intention - is essential to his scheme. That's not the karma of your 
"infernal" couple 'karma-and-reincarnation' of a few posts ago. Karma 
per se seems to me to be a very useful notion in Batchelor's 
philosophy. I wonder why he doesn't use it. Have I gotten it all wrong ?

>I can't do away with Unconditioned, with karma and reincarnation, with
>God etc. etc. because others, in word, though, and books, keep
>bringing them up. They will always be reference points, whether I
>believe in them or not. In my own thinking, reading and in my
>discussions with others, I will be confronted with them, challenged by
>them and I will see if I can do away with them, every time again.

In a talk during the presentation tour in answer to a question from 
the audience Batchelor admitted that certain mythical or metaphysical 
notions may have some positive effect in the lives of some people, 
but the drift of his book is that he prefers his own buddhism sans.

Herman