[Buddha-l] Back to the core values?

[jkirk]

Dear Andy,

I was as impressed by Batchelor's -Living with the Devil_ as you are. Thanks
for bringing out some of its many helpful arguments, and saving me the work
of doing it :)
Best wishes,
Joanna
===========================================================

Well the recent flurry of debate on Buddha-l has caught my attention, even
to the point of walking to the library and reading Batchelor's _Buddhism
without
Beliefs_  and as well his _Living with the Devil_.   Since curt is done, I
thought I might throw in a few snippets from the _Devil_  (in a sort of
Advocatus Diaboli way).

First, as regards the doctrine of rebirth and karma (especially in
Victoria's critique), it seems that Batchelor's agnostic Buddhism is
extremely critical of any doctrine that, as I would put it, is
deterministic.  There is a very large difference, I think, between karma as
a guide to action and karma as a justification for present suffering.
Crossing the two results in exactly the kind of justification of unethical
actions that Victoria mentions, but the real evil is in the view itself,
regardless of the actions that result.
Batchelor maintains that "religion" is the hardening of views, and this is
contrary to the goals of liberation.  Here is a bit from _Living with the
Devil_:

<quote>
John's gospel describes the devil as the "ruler of this world." In his
second
letter to the Corinthians, Paul calls Satan "the god [theos] of this age
[aion]." He spells out the implications to his followers in Ephesus:

	We are not contending against flesh and blood, but against the

principalities, against the powers, against the world rulers of the present
darkness, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in heavenly places.

This rich metaphorical language is a way of talking about all the despotic
and
pervasive forces that constrain our lives.  We can understand the devil as
those intimidating fiscal, social, political and religious powers, which we
reify into such entities as the Economy, Society, the Government, or the
Church, and then treat as though they possessed a person agency that has the

power to condemn or destroy us.
	"For the demonic," reflects the theologican Paul Tillich, "is the
elevation
of something conditional to unconditional significance." Each time something

contingent and impermanent is raised to the status of something necessary
and
permanent, a devil is created.  Whether it be an ego, a nation-state, or a
religious belief, the result is the same.  This distortion severs such
things
from their embeddedness in the complexities, fluidities, and ambiguities of
the world and makes them appear as simple, fixed, and unambiguous entities
with the power to condemn or save us.  Far from being consciously chosen by
individuals, such perceptions seem wired into the structure of our
psychological, social, religious, and biological makeup.
</quote> p. 14

Now this seems to me to be the essence of Buddhism, and Batchelor has put
his
finger on it.  Of course, it may not be agonstic, but it does agree very
much
with the  views of the Greek skeptics, that the claims to knowledge were
both
unfounded and the cause of much strife and suffering.

The second quote from the _Devil_  refers to Buddhist doctrine directly, the

parable of the raft.

<quote>
  Buddha compared the ideas and practices he taught to a raft [p. 158] made
of "grass, twigs, branches and leaves" tied together "for the purpose of
crossing over, not for the purpose of grasping."  Once the raft has enabled
one to cross that "great expanse of water, whose near shore is dangerous and

fearful and whose further shore is safe and free from fear," then it should
be discarded.  Otherwise it risks crystallizing into a sanctified version of

the repetitive, restrictive, and frustrating behavior one seeks to overcome.

One settles into comfortable spiritual routines, become fixated with correct

interpretations of doctrine, and judges with self-righteous indignation
anyone who corrupts the purity of the tradition.
</quote> p. 158-8

Now this I think is Batchelor's main problem with "religion,"  and I tend to

agree with him  (non-dogmatically, of course).  But it is more interesting
to
me in the sense that any religion can become a source of evil, a claim of
absolute truth that one  may grasp and then find threatened.  Buddhism is
not
exempted.

Finally, Batchelor contrasts the political milleu Buddhism has co-existed
with
for most of its history, and suggests that the west does have a superiority
when it comes to political ideals, and that Buddhism must, out of
consistency
with itself, drop the authoritarian accutrements of the past.

<quote>
Now that the Buddhist traditions of premodern Asia find themselves face to
face with the liberal traditions of modernity, each challenges the other to
look afresh at its understanding and practice of freedom.  Just as Buddhism
provides psychological insights and contemplative practices to free people
from their inner demons, so the liberal philosophies of [160] Europe and
America provide social insights and political practices to free people from
governments and religions that restrict their liberty to live as they
choose.
We thus come to appreciate the full extent of Mara's reach: intense private
hatreds share with complex societal structures of repression the same
capacity to block paths and limit freedom.
</quote>  p. 159


This should speak for itself.  But I suspect that Curt (and no doubt
Richard)
are far from finished.

As a final comment, which I know I should resist, I must ask:  is
neurophysiology the archeology of  Buddhism?　Sort of like search for Noah's

ark or the ossuary of Jesus?

Andy
--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ; ~ )
     J a m e s   ( A n d y )   S t r o b l e
          H o n o l u l u ,   H I
      h t t p : / / w w w 2 . h a w a i i . e d u / ~ s t r o b l e /

:The right way to seize a philosopher. Crates, is by the ears: persuade me
then and drag me off by them; but if you use violence, my body will be with
you, but my mind with Stilpo."  Zeno of Citium, Diogenes Laertius, VII:24
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

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