[Buddha-l] Re: Was Buddha a Buddhist

[Mike Austin]

In message <44770BDD.9010303 at email.smith.edu>, Jamie Hubbard 
<jhubbard at email.smith.edu> writes

>> One knows the Buddha by knowing the dharma.  Stories from history 
>>play  a very minor role in this.  The difference is like that between 
>>a  Buddhist and a Buddhologist. Whereas it could be debatable whether 
>>the  Buddha was a Buddhist, I would say he was certainly not a Buddhologist.
>>
>I think that most contemporary Buddhologists would say that Buddhists, 
>from the very beginning, have always known the Buddha by, well, knowing 
>the Buddha. The importance of his physical presence in helping his 
>followers to their own awakening has been well established.

You make some good points, Jamie. Being in the actual presence of a kind 
and wise person can certainly be inspiring.  And it is true that stories 
may help to convey those qualities.  The Cappala Sutta is one that comes 
to mind for me.

I am going to Brussels next week to see His Holiness the Dalai Lama. And 
again to France a few weeks later.  I find his qualities very inspiring. 
Whether he is 'awakened' or 'enlightened' or not, I can never know until 
I achieve that state myself. Therefore, I listen, learn and practice.

Now my point in this thread is that the history is not significant - for 
me, anyway. For example, I am no nearer knowing who the Dalai Lama is by 
stories of finding his reincarnation, or of his history. And the same is 
true of the historical Buddha. What really interests me is understanding 
dukkha and its causes, and cessation and its causes.  Stories do nothing 
to remove ignorance and delusion, however nice and uplifting they may be 
to hear.


>any Buddhist teacher worth her salt ought to be able to inspire an 
>encounter with the Buddha through a good story about Sakyamuni, no? I 
>certainly have experienced this often enough. . .

Could you describe this 'encounter with the Buddha'? Does it differ from 
an 'encounter' with any other historical figure when you think of them? 
Are you proposing some sort of darshan through using a mental image?

What I suspect is happening here  (and how I explain my experiences that 
are likewise) is a combination of two of the three faiths, i.e. admiring 
faith, aspiring faith, and convincing faith. I can see someone I admire, 
and it makes me feel empowered -  even as if I have already accomplished 
something. This should lead to the last and strongest convincing faith - 
that which comes from the experience of practice.

-- 
Metta
Mike Austin