[Buddha-l] Re: Greetings from Oviedo

[Benito Carral]

On Wednesday, October 5, 2005, Joy Vriens wrote:

>> I  think  this  is  really interesting, it has to do
>> with  the  "hapiness  myth."  Why  do most of people
>> think  that the goal of life is to be happy? I don't
>> agree.

> Because you are a realist ;-)

   Hahaha.  People  usually  tend  to  say  that  I'm a
pessimist,  although  I don't tend to agree with such a
view. :-)

   Today  I was talking with a friend for some hours. I
explained  him  my  view on Western society and why I'm
leaving  Oviedo  in  some  months  to live a completely
different   life  that  he  doesn't  understand.  As  a
concluding  remark, he said, "I suppose we are still in
the game because we don't have guts to shot ourselves."
Well,  it sounds as pessimistic, but I also offered him
an alternative.

   Chan  Fu said in other post that he doesn't know how
to  teach  perseverance.  I have learnt something about
that.  When  my  students  lost  interest in Dharma, it
usually is because they have forgotten why they started
to  practice  in  the  first  place.  They forget about
dukkha  because  they don't feel so bad as before. So I
think  that  they  key  to persevere in Dharma is to be
aware of both individual and collective dukkha.

   So  I  think  that not losing oneself in impermanent
amusements  is not to be a pessimist but a realist guy.
But  I  don't  worry too much about labels, because who
decides  what  a  pessimist  or  realist  is.  And most
important, does it matter?

>> As  far  as I know, the Buddha taugh how to end with
>> dukkha.  And  that  has  little  to  do with most of
>> people understand by happiness.

> Well,  he  did go on a bit sometimes about describing
> the end of dukkha as peace, bliss and what not more.

   But  you know that such comments in early suttas are
very  scanty  and  they  don't  seem  to  represent his
general message.

   Today I have asked to two different individuals what
they   understand   by  happiness.  One  told  me  that
happiness  is  feeling  good  and  that  he  feels good
following  G-d's way. The other one said that happiness
is  not  feeling  bad and feeling good sometimes, and a
good way to achieve it, she said, is to be entertained.

   Now  I'm  writing  a  book  and will keep asking the
question  in  order  to include the answers. It's clear
that "happiness" can be many different things.

   What did the old Indian Buddha have in mind?

      "Both  formerly  &  now, it is only dukkha that I
      describe,   and  the  cessation  of  dukkha."  SN
      XXII.86

   And how did he understand dukkha?

      "Birth  is  dukkha,  aging  is  dukkha,  death is
      dukkha;  sorrow,  lamentation,  pain,  grief,   &
      despair   are   dukkha;   association   with  the
      unbeloved is dukkha; separation from the loved is
      dukkha;  not getting what is wanted is dukkha. In
      short,  the five clinging-aggregates are dukkha."
      SN LVI.11


>> I  would  say  that, from the point of view of Early
>> Buddhism, the goal was to have peace of mind.

> I  disagree,  immortality  was there goal. Becoming a
> god amongst gods.

   I  have to disagree here. :-) If we talk about Early
Buddhism,  it's  clear  that  the goal is a "definitive
suicide" as I like to call it. The Indian Buddha didn't
want  to be reborn again. That was the goal, one shared
by  many  fellows  then. So it was just the opposite of
inmortality.   In  addition,  inmortality  of  what  if
everything is impermanent?

> That's  one of my main ingredients for happiness. Bon
> appetito.

   Thank you very much. :-)

   Best wishes,

   Beni